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Resources for Chagigah daf 9

1.     The משנה says that if someone was בא על הערוה והוליד ממנה ממזר, it is a מעוות שאינו יכול לתקן. See רש"י in ד"ה והוליד who says אין עוונותיו נמחקין which means he can’t do תשובה. However, see תוספות on the top of the עמוד who explains that מעוות שאינו יכול לתקן means that the בושה is greater with a ממזר, which sounds like you could do תשובה. See תוספות in בבא בתרא דף פּ"ח ע"ב who brings two דיעות whether you can do תשובה or not. There is a fascinating קובץ הערות in סימן כ"ב (at the very end) who says that there are two parts to תשובה: one part is that the עברה is נמחל מכאן ולהבא. The other (greater) part to תשובה is that it is עוקר החטא למפרע. He explains that by a ממזר, the person can achieve תשובה מכאן ולהבא. However, he cannot be עוקר the חטא למפרע. He also quotes ר' זילברברג מווארש"א who says that people ask how the אנשי נינוה were able to do תשובה when ספרים say that תשובה doesn’t help for בני נח? He answers that even בני נח have תשובה מכאן ולהבא. What is special to ישראל is the עקירת החטא למפרע.

 

2.     The גמרא brings the מחלוקת between ר' יוחנן and ר' אושעיא as to whether all seven days are תשלומין דראשון or if each day is תשלומין זה לזה. In explaining ר' אושעיא, see רש"י in ד"ה כולן תשלומין who explains that ר' אושעיא holds that whichever day the person becomes ראוי to bring a קרבן is the first day for that person. See the רש"ש here and on the first piece on דף ז' ע"ב who points out that רש"י here is making a critical point: ר' אושעיא is not suggesting that you have the option to bring the קרבן חגיגה any day of the מועד that you wish. Rather, everyone agrees that the first day is the main day and all other days are תשלומין of that first day. The only disagreement is in a case where someone became ראוי on day two, if their first day can start on the second day. This explains why even according to ר' אושעיא you are allowed to bring the קרבן חגיגה on the first day of יו"ט, despite the fact that only קרבנות that must be brought on יו"ט may be brought on יו"ט. See תוספות in ד"ה כיון who (according to the ב"ח ‘s גירסא) says that according to ר' אושעיא if you are ראוי on day one and become a חגר on day two then you are פּטור מן הקרבן. It would seem from תוספות that he disagreed with רש"י and understood ר' אושעיא to hold that each day has it’s own completely independent חיוב, whereas רש"י would say that even ר' אושעיא might agree that if on day one you are חייב then you remain חייב.

 

3.     The גמרא says that according to ר' יוחנן, all of the other days are תשלומין דראשון. There is a מחלוקת ראשונים whether this even includes שמיני עצרת. In other words, what if someone was a חגר all seven days and was נתפּשט on שמיני עצרת? See the ריטב"א in סוכה דף מ"ז in ד"ה ונראה who says that even according to ר' יוחנן, since שמיני עצרת is a רגל בפני עצמו, if someone was first נתפּשט on שמיני עצרת, he would be חייב to bring a קרבן חגיגה! However, most ראשונים seem to disagree with this. (see תוספות there in ד"ה רגל). Moreover, see the מרומי שדה here who says quite the opposite—that even according to ר' אושעיא, the day of שמיני עצרת  is not תשלומין זה לזה. His proof is from תוספות in ד"ה כיון. There תוספות discusses someone who was healthy on day one and became lame on day two. תוספות seems to be asking according to שיטת ר' אושעיא what is the דין on day two, yet says of course he can’t actually bring it on day two. So what was the question? If תוספות meant to ask what the דין would be on day three if he got better, then why would it not be פּשוט that he is חייב since according to ר' אושעיא all days have their own חיוב? Rather, the מרומי שדה understood the question to be if he became a חגר on day two and stayed a חגר until שמיני עצרת where he got better. The question therefore was since everyone agrees that שמיני עצרת is not תשלומין זה לזה, is that fact that he was חייב on day one make him חייב now, or do we say since each day is תשלומין for the day before and the day before he was a חגר, he is not חייב anymore.


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