Nedarim - Daf 81

• Why it is uncommon for Talmidei Chochomim’s sons to be Talmidei Chochomim

Among other advice sent from Eretz Yisroel, it was taught: הזהרו בבני עניים שמהן תצא תורה – Be careful with the sons of poor people, because Torah will go out from them. The Gemara asks: ומפני מה אין מצויין ת"ח לצאת ת"ח מבניהן – Why is it uncommon for Talmidei Chochomim to have sons who are Talmidei Chochomim? Five answers are given:

Rav Yosef said: שלא יאמרו תורה ירושה היא להם – so that [the sons] should not say that Torah is an inheritance for them, and they do not have to study diligently.

Rav Shisha son of Rav Idi said: כדי שלא יתגדרו על הצבור – so that they should not raise themselves over the public in arrogance.

Mar Zutra said: מפני שהן מתגברין על הצבור – because they dominate the public.

Rav Ashi said: משום דקרו לאינשי חמרי – because they call people donkeys.

Ravina said: שאין מברכין בתורה תחלה – because they do not recite the berachah on Torah before learning.

• שאין מברכין בתורה תחלה

Rav Yehudah said in the name of Rav: What is the meaning of the passuk: מי האיש החכם ויבן את זאת – “Who is the wise man who will understand this…For what did the land become lost, etc.?” דבר זה נשאל לחכמים ולנביאים ולא פירשוהו – This matter was asked of the Sages and the Prophets, and they could not explain it, עד שפירשו הקדוש ברוך הוא בעצמו – until Hashem Himself explained it: ויאמר ה' על עזבם את תורתי – “And Hashem said: Because of their forsaking My Torah, etc.” The Gemara asks that there are two phrases in the passuk (“they did not heed My voice” and “nor follow it”) that are apparently the same, and Rav Yehudah explained in the name of Rav: שאין מברכין בתורה תחלה – “Nor follow it” means they did not recite the berachah on Torah before learning. The Ran famously explains (in the name of Rabbeinu Yonah) that if “forsaking Torah” had meant that they did not learn Torah, then the Sages and Prophets would have understood well why the land was lost. Rather, they did learn Torah, which is why only Hashem could explain the destruction of the land. They did not sufficiently value the Torah for their Torah to be fitting to make a berachah upon

• If Rebbe Yose agrees that the husband can revoke the nedarim as דברים שבינו לבינה

The Gemara asks: According to Rebbe Yose (who does not consider bathing or adornment to be an afflictive issue), can the husband revoke these nedarim as דברים שבינו לבינה – matters between him and her? Does he consider refraining from bathing or adornment to affect their personal relationship, which would allow him to revoke them? If so, then although he cannot revoke the neder permanently, his hafarah would be effective for as long as she is fit to be married to him, as was taught on Daf 79b. The Gemara quotes a machlokes Amoraim about this point, and brings a Baraisa as support that Rebbe Yose does allow hafarah of these nedarim. In a list of four different types of nedarim a woman can make, the Baraisa teaches: שלא אכחול שלא אפקוס ושלא אשמש מטתי – If she says: “[Konam] that I will not paint my eyes,” or “that I will not apply rouge,” or “that I will not have marital relations,”יפר משום דברים שבינו לבינה – he may revoke them as matters between him and her. This Tanna, who does not consider adornment an issue of inuy nefesh, reflects the view of Rebbe Yose, and still allows him to revoke them as דברים שבינו לבינה.