Why don’t we say Kaddish d'Rabbanan, rather than Chatzi Kaddish, after the Shabbos morning drasha that immediately precedes Mussaf?

The Shabbos morning drasha is common in many communities, but the exact placement of the drasha differs from one community to another. The concept of a drasha on Shabbos is referenced numerous times in Chazal [1] but the time and placement are not mentioned. Rashi [2] writes that a drasha/shiur took place prior to Tefillas Mussaf but is unclear if that refers to the same sort of Shul setting that we are familiar with. The question assumes a situation when the drasha is said just before Kaddish, however, this itself may be questionable in part due to the placement of Kaddish. The Maharam Shick [3] was asked by his nephew if it is proper to hold the drasha prior to the Kadish said before Mussaf, because ideally there should be no interruption between Ashrei and Kaddish [4]. Moreover, if in fact the drasha is said at that time, wouldn’t it be appropriate to recite the קדיש דרבנן as is customary after Torah learning?

He responds that ideally the drasha should be said prior to Krias Hatorah as this had been the initial custom [5]. He also suggests that the drasha may be said immediately after the Haftorah as it is done on Rosh Hashanah, prior to Shofar. Nevertheless, he believes that there is no intrinsic problem in placing the drasha before Kaddish. He argues that a drasha wouldn’t be considered a הפסק between אשרי and קדיש. He cites the Rema [6] who writes that on Yom Kippur a ברית מילה is done after קדיש, apparently the Rema felt that the performance of other mitzvos is not an issue of הפסק [7]. But the Maharam Shick cites other Achronim who argue with the Rema as they believe that אשרי should lead directly into קדיש with no interruption including the performance of mitzvos. The Maharam Shick agrees with his nephew that Kaddish said before beginning Mussaf is in essence connected to אשרי and thus it is improper to have any sort of הפסק between אשרי and קדיש, with a drasha/mitzvah being an exception. This too is the assumption of the Magen Avraham [8] and Mishna Berurah [9]. However, the Rema [10] when discussing Kaddish said between ישתבח and ברכות ק"ש implies that Kaddish is not necessarily connected to what comes before, but rather it leads into whatever follows [11] As such, there would be no issue in saying the drasha between Ashrei and Kaddish [12].

Regarding קדיש דרבנן, the gemara [13] speaks of the significance of the Kaddish recited after Torah learning, specifically after learning תורה שבעל פה ומדרשות [14]. Thus, the קדיש דרבנן can be said after the standard drasha. Nevertheless, the Maharam Shick suggests that specifically חצי קדיש is to be said prior to תפילה and not קדיש תתקבל. He cites the Rabbeinu Yonah who understands the gemara [15] שיכוונו לבם למקום as a requirement that one focus on Hashem’s loftiness prior to davening. The חצי קדוש ends with the words לעלא מן כל ברכתא thus it is appropriate segue to davening. קדיש דרבנן has the very same theme but because it continues onto other themes it is not the ideal קדיש to be said before Tefilah.

[1] Mishna, Eiruvin 3:4, Yerushalmi, Horayos 3:5

[2] Brachos 28b d.h.

[3] OC 126

[4] source

[5] See Mateh Ephraim 602:42.

[6] 621:2

[7] see Aruch Hashulchan OC 54:2

[8] 284:7

[9] 284:15

[10] Darkei Moshe 54:1

[11] See Rambam Tefillah (9:1)

[12] The Maharam Shick adds that perhaps the reason for the original custom not to have the drasha before Mussaf is based upon the gemara (Brachos 31a) אין עומדים להתפלל אלא מתוך הלכה פסוקה. To ensure that one is not distracted during davening, one should not engage in complex Torah topics as this may distract one from davening. However, he retorts that the style of drashos commonly offered are primarily Aggadah and thus should not distract the davening at all and thus the common custom is justifiable.

[13] Sotah 49a

[14] Rambam (Seder Tefilah). See Mishna Berura (54:9) who assumes that this Kaddish is said only after learning דברי אגדה.

[15] Brachos 30b